Stef says, "God Bless LiMi..."

Dylboz · Number of posts: 2014 Registration date: 2007-09-20

But rick, how did you feel when you wrote that?

Phlogiston · Number of posts: 621 Location: NOLA Registration date: 2007-10-25

Actually I think the kid, KF, was awarded a black belt too. In all fairness, I think Stef glossed over the over-the-top and was just trying to point to the civl conflict-resolution.
Unfortunately I think the push for apology was the only thing that was wrong. Its like saying well done to people who despute over my asking what you said. IF you have an argument its great to settle it. If you have an argument over nothing its shameful you had something you had to settle.

reddeerrick · Subject: Re: Stef says, "God Bless LiMi..." Tue Nov 13, 2007 1:36 am

Phlogiston wrote:

Actually I think the kid, KF, was awarded a black belt too. In all fairness, I think Stef glossed over the over-the-top and was just trying to point to the civl conflict-resolution.

OK but all KF did after his initial post was tried to placate his attackers. It was immediately made clear that he had said something wrong, and he just scrambled around trying to find the right thing to say to make it better. At least that's how it looked to me. And I guess it makes perfect sense that KF would also get a black belt from Stefan for this; I'm sure that's how he would have preferred for us (LM'ers) to have resolved our conflicts with him.

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Phlogiston · Number of posts: 621 Location: NOLA Registration date: 2007-10-25

HAHA! agreed.
Instead of trying to console the new person he had to defend a simple question.
I guess we are all here because we wouldn't back. Our arguments stood for what we meant and we wouldn't stand for that argument from your parents. Our parents might be the case but not an answer to our questions.

fourvoicechord · Number of posts: 51 Registration date: 2007-09-22

reddeerrick wrote:

Speaking of "sycophants piling on", did anyone catch the recent thread where Nathan provided a fairly pointless interpretation of a song lyric? A 16 yo kid asked him bluntly what the point of his post was, and was subsequently ambushed with psychologizing and pressure to apologize by several members of the lickspittle squad. Holy Moly awarded them all "black belts" afterward. Pretty sad. Sad

Hey, can you give a link for that thread?

Scott

reddeerrick · Subject: Re: Stef says, "God Bless LiMi..." Tue Nov 13, 2007 10:41 am

Crap! Half an hour ago, I could have, but the IP I'm at now is blocked. I think the thread is called "Not Perfect" by Nathan. Should be in the first 3 pages of active topics.

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Dylboz · Number of posts: 2014 Registration date: 2007-09-20

fourvoicechord wrote:

Hey, can you give a link for that thread?

Scott

Not Perfect?

One more reason that Stef likely wont have kids is it might force him to admit to not being perfect. I have always been troubled by the lack of empathy for parents expressed by Stef and FDR. They are unwilling to see their parents as anything other than 2D cardboard cutouts of evil. Their history might not necessarily excuse abuse (if it occured) but it might help explain it, and thereby mitigate the horror a child might have had over it once they are old enough to understand such things. It might be more convienient to have a sort of moral scapegoat, but it fails afford parents the same curiosity we are supposed to offer to and expect from others. They exist in a seperate category, since they "can't be changed." Perhaps they are too old to change, but they can still be understood as flawed human beings who have something left to teach us, even if they don't realize it, or how it might be taught.

We may learn that it is impossible to have and raise children without inadvertent trauma or what they might percieve as abuse even when we are acting out of love. And besides, even if it were possible, think of the sudden shock and horror that child would suffer upon reaching the "real world." I do think intent and context are important to making moral judgements, and we should consider that when judging whether our parents really did "do the best they could."

Bottom line, no one is perfect. And if we have perfection as our standard and expectation for the real people in our lives, we will be sorely dissapointed in everyone, not least ourselves. If we wait until we achive perfection before having kids, we will never, ever procreate. Ideals are just that, ideal, and therefore outside of reality. True, if we shoot for the stars, we may hit the moon, but we shouldn't fret over the fact that we aren't orbiting an earth-like planet in Alpha-Centauri. The moon is pretty cool.

fourvoicechord · Number of posts: 51 Registration date: 2007-09-22

reddeerrick wrote:

Crap! Half an hour ago, I could have, but the IP I'm at now is blocked. I think the thread is called "Not Perfect" by Nathan. Should be in the first 3 pages of active topics.

That means that Stef deliberately blocked you from accessing the FDR website?

reddeerrick · Subject: Re: Stef says, "God Bless LiMi..." Tue Nov 13, 2007 5:55 pm

Yep, about a month ago he cancelled my account, and IP banned me, simply because I was posting on LM. As soon as I revealed my FDR username on LM, it happened.

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fourvoicechord · Number of posts: 51 Registration date: 2007-09-22

Dylboz wrote:

One more reason that Stef likely wont have kids is it might force him to admit to not being perfect. I have always been troubled by the lack of empathy for parents expressed by Stef and FDR. They are unwilling to see their parents as anything other than 2D cardboard cutouts of evil. Their history might not necessarily excuse abuse (if it occured) but it might help explain it, and thereby mitigate the horror a child might have had over it once they are old enough to understand such things. It might be more convienient to have a sort of moral scapegoat, but it fails afford parents the same curiosity we are supposed to offer to and expect from others. They exist in a seperate category, since they "can't be changed." Perhaps they are too old to change, but they can still be understood as flawed human beings who have something left to teach us, even if they don't realize it, or how it might be taught.

I think you have isolated a basic problem--if not the basic problem--with Stef's DeFoo quasi-imperative. There does seem to be something wrong if a parent did his best but still erred, and the child cuts all ties with him. I think Stef finds it easy to urge people to DeFoo because his family were so patently rotten (and I don't doubt a word of what he's said about his family, judging from his own defensive, screwy behavior). My parents are almost as bad, and still continued to behave badly even when I became an adult, which made it easy for me to end my relationship with them (even though my DoFoo was FDR-influenced, I've never gone back to my parents. It was the right move.). I think, though, that its a fly in the ointment that he insists on forcing all parents into the "evil" template mostly because of emotional issues that grow out of his bad family relationships. It represents a blindness to reality that he himself would purport to eschew.

What galls is that he regularly pronounces himself to be--as a result of his years of psychotherapy--mentally clear and conflict-resolved when its so obvious that he projects and denies all over the place!

Dylboz wrote:

Bottom line, no one is perfect. And if we have perfection as our standard and expectation for the real people in our lives, we will be sorely dissapointed in everyone, not least ourselves. If we wait until we achive perfection before having kids, we will never, ever procreate. Ideals are just that, ideal, and therefore outside of reality. True, if we shoot for the stars, we may hit the moon, but we shouldn't fret over the fact that we aren't orbiting an earth-like planet in Alpha-Centauri. The moon is pretty cool.

[i]

Well said. In a nutshell, if a parent obeys the non-aggression axiom as much as humanly possible with his child, and apologizes and allows open communication when he breaches, that should go a long way to raising a happy, healthy child.

Scott

fourvoicechord · Number of posts: 51 Registration date: 2007-09-22

[quote="Dylboz"]
Not Perfect?

I just read the thread.

Sheesh!

Stef doesn't even have to beat anyone up anymore. His courtiers do it for him.

*No-prizes* to Nathan, Cogito, D.B. and Ash.

Scott

reddeerrick · Subject: Re: Stef says, "God Bless LiMi..." Tue Nov 13, 2007 6:46 pm

It's a truly bizarre world that FDR is turning into.

Stef declares that "nitpicking" his theories is an awful waste of precious time, but he encourages his virtual army of isolated navel-gazers to while away their days on his board, contemplating the significance of song lyrics and finding clever ways to parrot his words and attacking any who dare interrupt. Oh yeah, he has also declared that his board is but a tiny insignificant part of his plan to save the world.

No sooner does he declare that a fat man can't be effective in delivering philosophy than he hires a 300 pounder to be his junior philosopher.

W-T-F?

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Moe · Number of posts: 148 Registration date: 2007-10-25

reddeerrick wrote:

No sooner does he declare that a fat man can't be effective in delivering philosophy than he hires a 300 pounder to be his junior philosopher.

W-T-F?

Well he's not really a junior philosopher. He'll be doing the grunt work like advertising. Well said about the bizarreness though.

reddeerrick · Subject: Re: Stef says, "God Bless LiMi..." Tue Nov 13, 2007 7:00 pm

Oh, I assumed that since Greg describes himself as an "internet philosopher" that he had permission to do so.

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Moe · Number of posts: 148 Registration date: 2007-10-25

Everyone's a philosopher! Smile